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Will Wight

Iteration: Any universe that the Abidan recognize as capable of sustaining human existence and living out a complete life-cycle.

Every Iteration has a destined progression. A world is born, it lives out its existence, and then it quietly dies, breaking into fragments. These fragments float through the void, crashing and combining randomly until they form into a new universe.

They are called "Iterations" because the thousands of universes currently in existence are thought to be different versions of the same original world or worlds, spun out in different combinations again and again for eternity. Even the Abidan Judges do not know when this cycle began.

On its own, an Iteration should exist for billions of years, except for a certain underlying requirement: each Iteration is anchored to the Way by sentient consciousness. As long as humans* are around, the world is tethered to the natural law and order of the Way. The fewer humans there are, the looser that connection becomes.

When humanity dies, the world dissolves.

*(The Abidan definition of "human" is pretty loose, but never too far removed from the humanity we know. When a new Iteration forms that may be able to support life, the Abidan select a new population of human pioneers and send them to inhabit a suitable planet.)

Questioner

Many paths seem that all they need to do is hit somebody with one hit and the person dies, ex. Heavens Glory. It seemed like if somebody was hit, they die. What keeps underlords, sages, from being just one shot K.O. by a Jade or lowgold?

Will Wight

Within your body, your madra holds sway. This is why non-pure madra can't be effectively used in an Empty Palm style technique, because you can't just "inject" your madra into someone and expect it to do anything. It's also why fire Paths don't just set the air in their opponent's lungs on fire and walk away.The reason why a Heaven's Glory Jade can't just gun down an Underlord is an expansion of this principle. If your madra is sufficiently more powerful than your opponent's, it becomes hard for their Striker techniques to even hurt your skin. Often, the madra is simply dispersed when it touches you. The same is true for Forged madra--it can be dispersed by the natural madra of a more-advanced opponent.Ruler techniques will work equally on anyone, so they're usually what you use if you have to fight a more advanced opponent. However, there are some drawbacks.First of all, not every Path has a battle-ready Ruler technique. Second, Ruler techniques often take a long time to implement; you have to gather up compatible aura in the area and then activate it in a specific manner.It's also expected that an Underlord will have more powerful Ruler techniques than a Truegold, or will sense what is happening and dodge or disrupt it.As for Enforcer techniques, they of course work fine against higher-level opponents. But usually, someone more advanced than you will also get better results out of their Enforcer techniques. ml

Green0Photon

Can you explain what's going on with Madra being pure, dense, deeper, etc.? What does Madra quality/density mean? For example, low gold Yerin was better than random Sandvipers (besides skill), or the parasite ring did *something* to improve Lindon's quality. I don't understand what that is. Just a short off hand explanation is fine, we can get something deeper later, not on voice chat.

Will Wight

So the idea of density is really what you are asking about. So really, your madra is kind of like water but you can make it have the consistency of honey, for instance. So, there's purity, there's how dense and potent it is. So, how much one drop...using the liquid analogy, how strongly flavored it is. So what that does, is a little bit of madra goes a longer way than somebody else's a lot of madra. So that's sort of the idea. I kind of mixed answers there. I did both the texture and the effect. But, basically what it's talking about is when you convert aura to madra its kind of loose, it's not very potent, and then you concentrate it. And so, the density of madra has to with the concentration; how concentrated it is.

Questioner

So there’s multiple examples of Sacred Artists having “living techniques” like the mentioned Path of the Crawling Shades during Blackflame I believe or Jai Long’s own twistedd path. Do techniques like these require a certain kind of madra (dream madra, life madra, Blood madra?) or can any madra or path create “living techniques”?

If they need a certain kind of madra what kinds are needed?

Will Wight

It's not a particular aspect of madra, so to speak. It's another ingredient that we'll go into eventually.

Lil' Blue

Is Seth the Cradle take on the 1000 year old dragon loli?

Will Wight

Sort of. No joke. The existence of that trope definitely played into his existence. Because I am aware in most anime and manga he would be a prepubescent girl, which just have weird undertones. So now he's a young boy, because that just doesn't get done very often. The main reason was because it emphasizes a couple things, one is he intentionally took this form to walk among humans. He doesn't hate humans, he has no opinion on humans, strong humans are cool; weak humans suck. So therefore he takes a form that is nonthreatening, when he veiled himself and goes among humans, and also it is a nice contrast to his dragon form which is huge and monstrous and threatening. So you have this [Can't tell what Will says here] regular twelve year old dude, when actually he is this 12 bazillion year old dragon.

Questioner

What specifically is the difference between cycling vital aura to add it to your core and cycling madra to add it to your core like Jai Long does after he absorbs a remnant with the Ancestor's Spear? I thought cycling was the process of turning vital aura into madra but if you have to cycle madra you acquire directly then maybe I'm wrong.

Will Wight

"Cycling" is just moving madra through your body through certain patterns. You can cycle aura into madra, cycle your madra to prepare for certain techniques, etc.

GL

Does Lindon create his own weapon with the soulsmith things he took from pyramid? Cause so far he hasn't used a weapon beyond a spear.Does being a soulsmith require a specific talent in madra uses? 

Will Wight

1.) Read and find out!

2.) Essentially yes. We touch on this in Blackflame a little bit, but you have to have madra that's compatible with a lot of other aspects.

For instance, the Fishers make good Soulsmiths because they have madra that mimics gravity. So it binds two things together. Not a whole lot conflicts with that.

But if you were a Sandviper Soulsmith, every construct you made would be poisonous or acidic, so it would either hurt the person holding it, fall apart, or neutralize the madra you tried to use to build it.

Daniel

Huh so the greatest soul smith would theoretically have to have pure madra because that would conflict with nothing. Unless their is a path of anti madra somewhere

Will Wight

Not necessarily pure, just widely compatible.

Questioner

Pure Madra as a building material in the emperor's palace?

Will Wight

Pure madra is an unreliable building material. It breaks easily, and it's so impressionable that placing it next to any other Forged madra will cause the two types to mix, changing both of their properties. However, it is used decoratively. Sometimes it is used to substitute for stained glass; you Forge a pane of pure madra and then stain it in spots with madra of different colors and properties. The other madra spreads like paint through the glass, creating a moving, swirling, blending canvas of living power. You just have to be careful about how long you let it sit and how much power you put into it, or it might randomly create a powerful effect.

Corey

When an iteration is formed but there is no human life there yet, how does the Way sustain the iteration? Is there a specfic amount of time that the Abidan have to populate it before the iteration will break down?

Will Wight

There is a certain amount of time! Depends on a lot of factors, including the stability and compatibility of the fragments that combine, which is part of what the Ghosts do: they're trying to ensure that the newborn worlds remain as stable as possible for as long as possible.

Incidentally, most of the "pioneers" that the Abidan drop on a world are not aware of the Abidan or of the full scope of the universe. It would be an experience like thinking you've died, only to see a flash of blue light and to wake up in a field with a bunch of supplies and strangers. This is your life now.

J

Please tell me you plan on writing a book or seven following this plot point. That would be so cool, starting up a new civilization in a new universe with different laws of physics and magic systems for the people to figure out. God that would be a fun read....

Will Wight

That was the book I wanted to write before House of Blades. I spent so long working on it that I had taken it way too many directions, so I thought, "This is my best idea, but I don't think I'm capable of writing it right now. What is an idea I have that I can DEFINITELY write and finish?"And that's how House of Blades was born.

Diego

I'm going to just put this out there and I don't know if it's just me or if its happening but not large scale enough to affect every corner of the multi-universe you have envisioned.

Wouldn't it actually be beneficial for these world spanning Organizations to encourage most, if not all , worlds to at least be aware of some way of ascending?

I mean heck if I knew how to become an immortal u could bet I'd be at least trying. In my head at least having more immortals around means more people to combat chaos. I mean even if some turn out evil, who wants chaos to destroy everything?

Will Wight

The thing is, their priority is to let worlds develop naturally.

Cradle is an exception to the norm in that advancement is built into its magic system. In most worlds, you'll be lucky to get one low-ranked Abidan out of it during its entire lifespan.

So in most worlds, it's not possible under normal conditions to ascend.

And here's part of the reason they want these Iterations living healthy, natural, normal lives: the more healthy and ordered the Iterations are, the closer the Way is, and the more powerful the Abidan are.

***

However, they actually HAD plenty of people in the Abidan. As many as they needed.

It was only when Ozriel vanished that they all of a sudden had a personnel problem.

(I'll go into that in Ozriel's section.)

Daniel

That kind of implies that there was one starting human universe where the way was born if the new iterations don't have enough time to evolve humans normally

Will Wight

It does imply that, yeah. However, wherever humans originated, it comes from a time before Abidan were keeping records. The theory is that the original human world already dispersed into fragments.

However, it could be out there somewhere.

There's another theory that says that the Way is like an island, and the void (chaos) is like an ocean. Which means that there could be other islands out there, other multiverses, where the Way emerges from the void and existence is possible.

Therefore, the original human world could simply be separated by chaos that everyone assumes is endless.

...or not. It's speculation.

Questioner

It has been confirmed by Will that Lindon does not need his pure core to offset the blackflame madra degeneration of his madra channels, as Lil'Blue can heal the damage caused

Will Wight

I may have said this, but it’s not entirely accurate/complete. With Little Blue’s help, Lindon could replace his pure Path with another random Path and not be crippled from damage to his madra channels. However, he would have to play around Blackflame damage by intentionally limiting the amount he used Blackflame. Basically, he’d use his other Path as the default and Blackflame as backup.

Whereas with pure madra, since it causes almost no strain to the madra channels and even somewhat helps cleanse impurities, he can lean on Blackflame harder.

Point is, he could learn another Path if he wanted, he’d just have to be intentional about managing his madra.

Questioner

What can Dream madra do besides read Fate? Are Time and/or Space actual madra aspects?

Will Wight

Dream madra affects thoughts and perception.Space madra is somewhat different than most aspects; it's not shaping madra INTO space, as that makes no sense, but there is a way to develop madra so that it affects space.

Jack

1) You said each world had its own magic system. Does Amalgam have its own system seperate from the territories or is that all it had from the beginning?

2) Some iterations have galactic colonies. Are there aliens in the Willverse?

Will Wight

1.) Amalgam's magic system is its unique property that allows it to collect and draw power from Territories. 

2.) There is alien life, but the only sentient non-human life was either once human or gained sentience from humanity in some way.

The Elders, for instance, were never human, but they gained the ability to interact with the world in a way we recognize as intelligent from humanity.

Green0Photon

What does a core being deep mean, that is, does it have extra-dimensional depth? Does this have anything to do with why spinning your core make it more dense?

Will Wight

They say deep just kind of as a word to explore that. It's not literally elongated in depth. That's just how the describe capacity; so a deep core can hold more madra. The dense madra is more effective with a little bit, so very concentrated madra is more powerful; not more powerful in terms of you throw an energy blast and it does more damage than somebody else's energy blast but more like your mana costs go down. So, if you've got dense madra you can use less madra to accomplish to the same goal. And if you have deep cores, then you have more maximum mana. So, that's basically the idea.

Ira

How did they make it to the island on the ship without crashing.

Will Wight

When they were making it to the island on the ship-I assume you're referring to the chapter one of Underlord-they made it to the island on the ship. They had enough fuel and cloud aura and cloud madra to make it there no problem. And then they were making it back and none of them had any cloud aura, which Renfei did. So they didn't have a reserve of cloud scales or anything, she just powered it herself. So therefore, they're flying black without Renfei, they only have pure madra, blackflame madra, sword madra, and shadow madra on board. And none of that powers [the ship? buckshit?]. There you go.

Questioner

How does life madra affect other kinds if madra it is mixed with?

Will Wight

Life madra is strange. It's widely known on Cradle that your experience and the aspects of your Path affect how you perceive aura. Some types of less-tangible aura--like destruction, for instance--can't be detected by some people at all. These are usually the aspects that deal with intangible concepts. Therefore, in theory, life madra would be difficult for the average person to perceive. But it isn't. This is believed to be because we are all acclimated to life aura ourselves, as living beings, and because we're surrounded by plants and animals even before Copper. Life madra interacts with the force that animates a living being. HOW it interacts depends on the Path and the technique. Let's take life and fire, for instance. One Path might have a flame that uses life for fuel, consuming the target even underwater. Another Path might have a flame that ignites a life-fire and gives you inexhaustible life aura, meaning you have more energy and heal faster. It's a weird one.

Questioner

I've noticed that spent Madra often returns to essence. Is that somehow recycled into aura? 

Will Wight

Yes/  So in the books, I establish how constructs and forged madra, well, all madra does this, it's just I pay attention to it with remnants and forger techniques, dissolves into these motes or sparks of rising light and dissolves back.  Yeah, madra dissolves back into aura.  That's what essence is.  It's kind of madra fuzzing back into aura.  So yeah, that does happen.  But because of the way it dissolves it's not useful for ruler techniques.  I mean, eventually it would be; you could sit there and let it dissolve and eventually you would have some aura to use, but it disperses quick, and aura tends to change form based on what it's around, so it's not good for fueling ruler techniques, but it is something that get cycled back into the aura of the world.

Fable

Why can't life madra be forged into a solid object?

Will Wight

Life madra can not be forged into a solid object because, there's a few reasons, one is it flows through very.....fluidly? I don't know how to put this, i don't know any terms here, because I didn't make terms for the physics of madra. Its just not rigid, it flows in a constant movement pattern through living things, so therefore it's always in motion, it's never static, that's why its not in a solid form.  Meta answer: I needed different physical properties for different types of madra because that creates challenges in soulsmithing, and it sorta made sense that they'd have different properties, so that's how that happened.

Fable

At some point would you be willing to add a table describing how to cycle the basics of Madra? As well as some of the properties that certain Madra's possess? I am wondering this because I am trying to make mechanics for a Cradle Quest. (Quest meaning something like a DnD game that is run online.) If you do not have an answer at this time then I have a simpler question. What exactly is force madra, how do you cycle it, and how does it work? 

Will Wight

So I definitely need to do that, this is something i probably need to bring up to the team, although they're certainly hearing this and are gonna hold me to this whether I want to do it or not. That's something I definitely need to do, i really probably need to do some sort of index or whatever for every series.....appendix that was the word i was looking for. The problem is it kind of changes based on the book, so you learn something new every book. So i either have to post just the very basics, so the very basics that you would learn in Unsouled, or the stuff that everybody knows, or I'd have to update it every book. So of course, before ebooks, you'd have all this at the back of the book, now i can create a page on my site and just link to it, so i could just have kind of a constant explanation encyclopaedia sorta thing up there. Its a lot more work that it sounds like, unless i do just the bare minimum and just put like a description up there of just kind of generally how the the madra system works. But i know i need to do something and i'm fully willing to do it, its one of those things that i feel like always is on my priority list, but never high enough to actually do, so it never gets to the top, so I'm sorry about that.

Lightsyde

This is my favourite blog since 'Ancestors of Cradle'!! Fun reading!!!

How aboutGrom (The Archmage of Menzoberanzan) vs Elder Whisper

Ryu Hayabusa (from Ninja Gaiden 2) vs Yerin?

Goku (ignoring anything past the Main Buu Saga) vs Northstrider?

Is there anyone in the Cradle world (not the universe itself but the planet) that can take one Majin-Buu or Majin-Vegeta?

Evangeline Kitty McDowell (from UQ Holder) vs Luminous Queen Sha Maria?

Touta Konoe (UQ Holder) vs Yerin

Esdeath (Akame ga kill) vs Li Markuth

More to come later =(^-^)=

Will Wight

This thread has gotten so long! It's been awesome, but now I'm having trouble keeping track of it all!

1.) Grom vs. Elder Whisper

I'd like to give it to Whisper because of the flexibility of madra vs. Vancian magic, which relies on prepared and memorized spells and material components. That said, I'd think it would depend on where they fought. Elder Whisper relies on light aura, and Menzoberranzan is in the Underdark. There is some bioluminescence for decoration, but the dark elves primarily rely on infravision to see. No light aura, and Elder Whisper's powers are more limited. Plus, Grom can attack directly, which Elder Whisper essentially can't. Grom gets it.

2.) Ninja Gaiden 2 Ryu Hayabusa vs. Yerin

I have to say I didn't play 2; I played 1, and I played Dead or Alive, but not 2. So if the specifics of what I say are wrong, forgive me.

I'd think Yerin would get it because she's from a magic system with more magic. Everything she does is infused with madra--she's strengthened by madra, throwing blades of madra, using the power of an opponent's blades against them.

Ryu has powers of his own, as well as a great deal of training, but for the most part he's swinging regular steel weapons. Yerin beats him.

3.) SS3 Goku vs. Northstrider

This is roughly the level of power I'm looking at for Northstrider. When he powers up, the world shakes for miles around. That sort of thing.

(Not blowing up planets, but they could do that in the Saiyan Saga, so I'm just kind of pretending DBZ characters can't do that.)

I'd think Goku would win, because Northstrider can't teleport or use ki blasts (unless between now and my introduction of the character I decide to give him that ability). In a straight punch-out, they'd be comparable.

4.) Majin Buu or Majin Vegeta

Yes.

5.) Evangeline vs. Sha Miara

UQ Holder Evangeline rather than Negima Evangeline, huh? Not that in her particular case it matters much, that's just interesting.

Evangeline has to win because she's immortal and Sha Miara isn't. In terms of magical firepower, I'd give it to Sha Miara, but I don't know that Evangeline has ever gone 100% all-out. Still a similar level.

6.) Touta Konoe vs. Yerin

Same thing: Touta wins because he can't be killed. So he basically can't lose a death match.

I'm also not fully clear on what his powers are, but the White Light of Mars can presumably disperse Yerin's Striker and Ruler techniques (though not her Enforcer techniques, which I'd guess would work more similar to chi in the Negima universe). Even if you say that dying once disqualifies him, Touta probably wins.

7.) Esdeath vs. Li Markuth

Esdeath can freeze *time itself,* which is pretty OP, but I think Li Markuth still wins. He's superhuman and has access to a broader variety of techniques.

Kazology

I was really surprised to see Lindon's arm start phasing through things in Ghostwater. In Skysworn there was no mention of this, and Lindon seems to consider the Cloud Hammer arm largely for having a similar property. Was this something that you decided afterwards should be common to all remnant prosthetics, or is there a reason we didn't see this happening before? Followup: Gesha told Lindon that eventually the arm would become as part of his spirit as his original one. Is Lindon's forgetfulness with cycling madra through it a sign this hasn't happened yet, or will he always have to consciously choose to make the arm solid?

Will Wight

That was just a mistake. Full explanation: I wanted there to be something more to the adjustment process for his new arm rather than just periodically losing control of it. The original idea, and the difference between that and the Cloud Hammer arm, was that the hunger madra arm would require him to focus on controlling madra in order to keep it doing what he wanted it to. However, as I wrote, that got shortened to "it phases through objects when it doesn't have enough madra" simply because that was easier to illustrate. So while the original idea was distinct from the Cloud Hammer arm, I completely forgot to keep it consistent in the end.